[Bug] Super 8 BD ISO fails to play

[chris57]

(01-07-2012 05:32 PM)m6rtg Wrote:  now we just need a similar firmware update for the A-300

Which you wont get as the C300 HAS a bluray license.

You need to be be talking Apples with Apples.

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(01-07-2012 03:19 PM)accident Wrote:  

(01-07-2012 02:33 PM)m6rtg Wrote:  Below is an excerpt of the marketing information for the A-300 on the Popcorn home-page

BluRay ISO Support
Never deal with scratched or damaged discs again with support for Blu-ray backup ISO files. With zero loss of movie quality and interactive menu support, you’ll have all the features of Blu-ray without all the hassles of physical media.

Excellent point.

What is? The BDLite/SimpleBD pop-up menu is interactive.

[m6rtg]

If you are correct then PCH have made a false declaration on the A300 production description and the product comparison PDF is also incorrect.

[cutter]

(01-08-2012 05:28 PM)chris57 Wrote:  

(01-07-2012 05:32 PM)m6rtg Wrote:  now we just need a similar firmware update for the A-300

Which you wont get as the C300 HAS a bluray license.

You need to be be talking Apples with Apples.

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(01-07-2012 03:19 PM)accident Wrote:  

(01-07-2012 02:33 PM)m6rtg Wrote:  Below is an excerpt of the marketing information for the A-300 on the Popcorn home-page

BluRay ISO Support
Never deal with scratched or damaged discs again with support for Blu-ray backup ISO files. With zero loss of movie quality and interactive menu support, you’ll have all the features of Blu-ray without all the hassles of physical media.

Excellent point.

What is? The BDLite/SimpleBD pop-up menu is interactive.

How are you certain that we won't be getting such a FW? M6rtg has provided the specs from Syabas clearly stating full BD navigation support for the A300 and I have been informed officially by Syabas the exact same thing. What makes you certain that we won't be getting a FW that resolves our reported issues? And do you still stand firm in your opinion that the A300 does not support full BD menus? If so, kindly state any official documents from Syabas.

[Willem53]

If so, kindly state any official documents from Syabas.... were it does say what you and m6rtg claim..

[cutter]

Gladly. You will notice the checkbox for Full BD navigation under A300.
http://files.syabas.com/popcornhour/down...n_2011.pdf

If this is not enough proof, I could provide you with the official support case number from Syabas where they have told me the same thing but I imagine this doesn't help much cause you have no way of checking our communication since you are not a Syabas employee.

[chris57]

That does not prove or mean anything. It can be taken away as easy as it was added to the A2x0 firmware recently.

You will not get the same firmware as the C series ever. As the C series has a Bluray license.

The interactive menu is the one that pops up when you use SimpleBD and you select from scenes, subtitles, etc.

[cutter]

A change in a player's official specs cannot be taken away, not without risking class suits anyway. Full Navigation? Syabas says check box. Thar's all I need to know.
I cannot understand how you can still have claim this means nothing when you have seen this presented to you officially from Syabas. Since I am not looking for a fight, this is my last response in this matter. The facts have been presented for all interested parties to evaluate.
I am continuing my troubleshooting with Syabas support and strongly advise all affected users to do the same since this will increase the chances for a quicker resolution to our problems and a FW release.

[Willem53]

Full BD navigation yes.... but not of the Commercial BD disk...(ISO)
Be aware that they don't mean Full as compared to Simple BD navigation... as Simple is not even mentioned in the chart so it's safe to assume that with "simple" you can "fully" navigate a BD.

You can see on this chart a very clear difference between C300 and A300, the difference is the ability to handle commercial optical disks.....note: no drive included.. ergo ability to navigate... only on Cxxx series.

ISO's is a legal swamp with regards to DRM and the industry.. so any support on a device that does not have a licence is a "technical" mistake or a user hack...

We discussed this marketing song and dance hype in a other thread...

Officially and legally I think you don't have a strong case... if any..


regarding this quote:
BluRay ISO Support
Never deal with scratched or damaged discs again with support for Blu-ray backup ISO files. With zero loss of movie quality and interactive menu support, you’ll have all the features of Blu-ray without all the hassles of physical media.

Do you read this to include or exclude copy protection schemes and complexities that even requires BD players to be updated regularly?

Point is... a company can never ever claim to support copies of copyrighted material... so assuming that they were talking about commercial copies..... is just that.. an assumption.

[m6rtg]

From a consumer perspective, the Commercial BD disk tick box in the comparison sheet is understood as the ability to play a physical disk (install an optical drive). There is nothing to indicate a difference in their abilities to play Blu-Ray Backup BD.ISO files.

Unless someone official from Syabas/PCH indicates otherwise, all other comments saying that the A-300 doesn't officially support Full BD Navigation and playback of BD.ISO files (when it clearly states it does on the product marketing) can only be personal speculation.

[chris57]

That's your understanding, you don't speak for everyone. I'm a customer and I certainly don't expect to receive the same playback as on the C series which costs far more and has a bluray license, that'd be greedy.

Would you not question yourself as to why people would have to pay so much more for the C series and read that and see that it is the only PCH player with a Bluray license. Perhaps due to the fact that it has the ability to fit a ROM drive.

On the A series you should be able to play back a 1:1 backup which has had its encryption removed. Independant of whether the A series can display the actual BD menu or introduces its own Interactive Menu you have the ability to fully navigate your backup. That navigation is not dependant on having the actual BD disc menu appear, as the interactive menu can select different videos, audio tracks, subtitle tracks, etc.

[jj666]

To be honest, that strikes me as "Xstreamer style" marketing if we are meant to believe that the same "Full BD navigation" tick can mean something different between the two models - given "simple BD playback" is usually referred to as "BDLite" playback in the media player world. Simple BD playback would not be suitable for instance in the case that there were TV episodes with multiple playlists on the same disk.

Can understand there should be a difference between the two models due to licensing, I just mean that the marketing doesn't show it.

For me also, I would take the A-series as a backup player (BDLite), and C-series as full player as the 200 series was at launch.

Cheers,

-jj-

[chris57]

The difference is that where it is possible it will show the actual Bluray menu, where it is not it wont. BDLite NEVER show an offical bluray menu.

The Interactive menu can cope with TV episodes and different versions of the movie. So its not just a hit and hope its interactive for you to select your episode or version of the film you want to watch.

How they can explain this on their official website without bring legal issues on top, and with a marketing degree is impossible.

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I dont think that any of us disagree that it could be a lot clearer in the marketing. Remember though that it will also be a lot clearer for the licensing authorities who may be pushed by the likes of Marvell, who wont give full navigation' unless a BD player in internal in the unit, to come down on those manufacturers that claim anything but smipleBD in their specs.

Syabas have written their own interactive menu, its the same as we see by pressignt he 'title' button when playing an MKV however it also has additional option for different playlists or something when I tried it when testing my BD ISO's.

You need to select 'Full Navigation' and not 'Prompt' I found to ever see an actual Bluray menu, if you have prompt I found it defaulted to the SimpleBD one. A bug there as it should ask. It was possible as when I selected Full Navigation in BD Navigation I got the original BD menu.

[Willem53]

BDLite = Full BD navigation.

Don't confuse this with Commercial BluRay disk Menu navigation... the A-300 is not a BluRay disk player...

read the specifications http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore/i...nItemId=45

only 2 types of navigation mentioned AVCHD navigation,Simple BD navigation

[jj666]

With the new Java protections (for example WARRIOR), where you have - intentionally due to protection - seamlessly branched, almost 50 playlists including 49 bad playlists (which play parts of the movie multiple times, or in the wrong order etc). I would not count that as a "full" navigation if I need to manually select the playlist - I've never known BDLite advertised as a full solution but always as a stripped down playback.

Cheers,

-jj-

[Willem53]

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